I know the Kill Odor is great but other than that I haven't used much Chemspec......I use mostly Prochem,Esteam and Ultrachem......but a local supplier  of quality chems would be awesome.

Enzall is generally regarded as one of the best enzyme presprays made. However I would not use it residentially. Prekleen is an enzyme prespray for residential situations that is by far the most popular with my staff.

Express Lane is a prespray similar to Ultrapac, it too has to be shaken all the time because it separates easily.

Heavy Duty Soil Lifter is a neutral prespray that is usually used as an addition to other presprays, whether they be for upholstery or carpets. You can use HDSL as a pretreatment for furniture that you will dry clean.

Energizer is a good oxidizing bleach that works synergisticly with other detergents/presprays and with Urine Decontamination Treatment for optimum results.

Formula 77 has long been a staple for companies as a great emulsifier. Need more kick go to Formula 90.

Then you have the DFC 105, 210 and Heavy Duty Cleaner. Food based ingredients only that will kick the hell out of soil.

Ecogent is another product they carry, we use it primarily as a pad cleaner.

Those are our favourites.

General Lee, I find it funny that you mention D.F.C towards the end of your favorite list, and EcoGent dead last. ( I guess the peroxide does count Jim Darling )

I can pull out many of your previous posts where you've said that all you use now is D.F.C because you want to preserve the health of your employees and customers.

I guess this is a prime example of the old saying

            " OUT OF SIGHT.......OUT OF MIND "

                                 Nightrider

I just answered the question Jack.

DFC and First Enviro are used in 90% of our residentials by our employees.

Ecogent has been relegated to mostly pad cleaning since DFC became a staple.

Prekleen is just too handy in the dining rooms with a thousand gray spots and grease in from the kitchen.

We have to be realisic too.

Nice try General, whatever I eat most of or like the best.........I mention first.

If you were to ask me what gas I put into my cars.......I would say without hesitation Canadian Tire.

I like Coke better, love big houses, I use Tide, use Enz-All for commercial, I use Ban-o etc etc

Whatecer comes to mind first is what you use most.........why........Because that's just the way the mind works..........we are creatures of habit.

I can clearly see that one of your habits is NOT using D.F.C or EcoGent as a regular product.

Don't even try to fool me, whatever you think of, I already thought of it.

                               Nightrider

You obviously don't know me at all.

I don't have time for b.s or trying to remember lies.

I truly believe in the non-toxic cleaners, anyone who knows me knows that its true.

My basement and trucks can be inspected at anytime if you want to try and prove me wrong.

I know you better than you think General, I examine what everybody writes, how they say things, spelling mistakes, and I remember every post of interest even if it dates back 2 years or so.

I don't have to inspect your trucks or talk to people that know you, I just have to inspect and examine the priorities of your interest, your words and actions tell me who and what you are, not the views or thoughts  through the eyes from 3rd party individuals.

One more mistake you just made General was posting a subconscious retraction validating your defence by a challenge for me to inspect or examine your trucks& basement then  fortified your position of credibility by multiplying your strength with numbers through the addition of " Everybody who knows you ".

Point is D.F.C & EcoGent is still last and the least used.

But if you really want to prove your point, post a pic of all the D.F.C & EcoGent in your basement and in your trucks.

                                Nightrider

time to lay down the crack pipe nightrider

there is nobody here who is more PRO green cleaning than Mr.Senter he's just not nieve enough to believe that they'll work in every situation

I have alot of respect for him simply because he has always been a straight shooter with me and knows his chemistry just as well if not better than anyone else on the boards

in fact I'll be writing down or copying his post just to recommend carrying the chems he suggested .

Chemistry.............what chemistry............so now there's chemistry in carpet cleaning, this is getting better as we go along.

Let me ask, besides me and maybe Jim, and perhaps Ted...............how many out here of you have a Bsc degree. or at least ever owned a chemisrty set when you were 8 years old and learned how to make ink.

                                  Nightrider

Revee, you and I will get along just fine........at least you know where the real world is.Oh I have one for you Revee...........perhaps you can examine a carpet to see how the electrical static pulses that is generated by friction in a carpet relate to the choice of chemical that must be used to clean it.

I guarantee that if you come up with some kind of anti-static combo of soap people will buy it, and even make a convincing argument to sell it to their customer.

                              Nightrider

Well said and thought of.........you must be a telemarketer.............you sure think like one

                                 Nightrider

heaven forbid CC's who are driving around with a van full of CHEMICALS know anything about chemistry before spraying them all over a customers home

What's your point Steaminpile.................not sure where you're going with that statement

                              Nightrider

you seemed to be implying that there was no need for chemistry knowledge to be a rug sucker???

maybe I misread?

Are you feeling alright Steaminpile.............of course there's no need, otherwise there would be regulations, permits, certification, mandatory classes, etc ,etc imposed by the government.

That's why cleaning chemicals must come with proper labels and in some cases msds sheets for the emloyees to administer proper use and medical information.

All the so called chemicals that you're using is on average 83% water

Knowledge never hurts, but unless you're retarded or hire a retard to work for you, the only chemisty knowledge you'll need as a carpet cleaner is how to make a cup of coffee in your truck between jobs.

1 cup black coffee, add 2 sugars, 2 cream, stir gently, and drink slowly...........carefull............it can be HOT.

                                  Nightrider

well I've personally seen some disasters with technicians mixing chems together

btw......don't mix citrus liquid with a 2 part coffee stain remover and sell it to the customer as the best stain remover ever

it will explode before they get to use it

I guess I'm more concerned with being a GOOD CC rather than a run of the mill rug sucker

This is the minimum required in Canada.

That's NOT TRUE General Lee.The worker does not have to know anything about the chemical, neither does he/she have to know how to interpret the msds info,NO controls, NO safety measures,& DOES NOT have to know how or where to dispose of said material and or empty container.The employer just has to supply the symbols of the dangers of chemicals, and supply the msds sheets on chemicals they are using. That's it. No More No Less.The law stipulates that the labels must be on the product, a msds sheet must be presented to or be posted whereas it has easy access to emloyee, some companies go as far as giving a 10 minute lesson on the chemicals.It is actually a law that you teach the dangers to your employees but 99% of companies seem to omit that expence.

Here sits the problem that is not enforced, the msds info must be in the 2 official Canadian languages, the problem is that most maintenance cleaning people are either Mexican, Italian, Greek, Spanish, or whatever......most don't speak the language and not smart enough to remember what you told them 3 minutes ago.In Quebec the employer just has to furnish the msds sheets in French as well as the labels. In the rest of Canada the employer just has to furnish the msds sheets in English as well as the labels.

Only the supplier must label in both official languages.

Listen I can make you a bomb with cow or horse sh*t and other stuff , intellengence plays a major role in any industry you work in.

Lee where's the pic of your basement and truck load of D.F.C and EcoGent

                                Nightrider

Better yet Nightrider hire a spy and have them do it. Then you won't be able to call me a liar again and say I'm setting up the situation.

I'll allow them in anytime, with me present. Just call me first since I'm not in the shop this week , they'll have to drive me in to the shop. Or do a "pop" inspection with no notice, I don't care. Most people already know the truth, you are just a sh*tdisturber. The Ecogent is still a plenty in the shop. We need to order DFC. I have a ton of First Enviro.

I doubt we have a case of all other previously mentioned WHMIS regulated presprays combined.

I also want you to put your money where your mouth is. I have NO PROBLEM WITH ANY FIGURE YOU HAVE IN MIND!!!

As for the WHMIS, you are way off.

Employees must know the hazards they are exposed to. This means they must have the knowledge (know the WHMIS symbols), must be able to APPLY THAT KNOWLEDGE, must be supplied the proper PPE and USE IT. Must be able to read an MSDS and apply the knowledge obtained from it.

You must also have a yearly refresher. I am always amazed at how poorly the techs do when confronted with a WHMIS refresher. Your office staff must also be WHMIS trained even if they don't handle the chemicals (provided they are in the same building).

In Ontario its under the OHSA Regulation 860 Section 6&7

General........Did you not take your medication today, relax.........I don't care what you clean with.

You can clean with lemon juice and tonic water for all I care. I suppose it would be the same as D.F.C ( It supposed to be made from food substance.

As far as a sh*tdisturber, you're right........... I am.

As far as hiring a spy.........I used to be one, and I was good at it, so was my wife.

As far as the WHMIS, I don't have to argue that point, just do a search wherever you like and see for yourself.

I have all the rules and regulations, I had to put them into practise everyday, and every new employee.

Tell me where I am way off, is it the language issue, the employees just have to have a copy of the symbols and hopefully understand them, and the msds sheets in either French or English and hope they can read. The employer must hold a class to teach of the chemicals they will be using and hope they remember.

That's it in a nutshell.

                               Nightrider

;you called your lawyer at midnight or later???

I smell something

No, I was already talking to her for almost an hour, I called at 10:30 and was clicking on KleenKuip at the same time & after reading Lee's post I asked her if she knew what it was all about.

She is also helping me to set up shop in the GTA 

She is a friend, not a hired lawyer.

I don't make up stories, just to post scrambled words.

                               Nightrider

Its in the OH&S Act of Ontario

Workplace Hazardous Materials Information System

R.R.O 1990, Reg 860, as am. O. Reg 36/93.

In my older copy I keep on my desk its page 598.

Where you are off is that they must be able to understand what to do and what to be careful of. They must be able to "apply their knowledge" with the information they have been provided.

Section 9(3)-An employer shall ensure, so far as reasonably practicable, that the program of worker instruction required by subsection (1) results in the workers being able to use the information to protect their health and safety.

Thanks............I found it. I'm not really sure if all this even falls in line with our products, although the guidelines are no more than what I mentioned, they seem to refer to " a controlled product " Degreasers, cleaning fluids, ban-o, cleaners containing butyl, javel, etc etc and all normal carpet cleaning products DO NOT fall under the guidlines of a " Controlled Product ".

As I mentioned before, as long as the labels are affixed to the containers, and there are msds sheets in a secure location where the employees have access to, and that the labels are in either English or French depending where you live all is within guidelines.

A 15 minute verbal instructional lesson is suffice and hope the employees can read, understand the language, and are not foolish enough to mix and shake things all around to try to get a spot off the wall.

General Lee, you are a Drama Queen, I would love to hear your fishing stories.

How big was the fish you caught Lee, THIS BIG.......How Big..........THIS BIG..........How Big...........THIS BIG...........How Big...........THIS BIG...........How Big.........................THIS BIG

I THOUGHT SO

    NIGHTRIDER

one thing I have to agree with is that when I started my biz and ever since there has yet to be any authority figure ask me about my chemical or WHIMIS knowledge

yes I've taken the courses and refreshers it's just that I don't think anyone cares except me

Don't count on any government agency asking you any question regarding your knowledge about chemicals, because they are not dangerous enough to warrant any inspection.

You have a 2 ton weapon in your hands everyday, that things can go wrong with, when was the last time you got stopped for a road inspection of your truck or car.

When was the last time you know of anybody that got a ticket smoking while putting gas into their car.

Rules and regulation are put on the books to make the politians look like they're doing a good job.

                              Nightrider

Bullroar.

I have a chronic sinus drip, I believe it is from the misuse of enzymes.\

I know many who can't tolerate butyls anymore.

The bottom line is WHMIS is an "information system".

Workers have rights. Supervisors and employers also have responsibilities.

As for no dangerous products on our trucks-would you drink or wipe yourself down with rust remover? how about Microban? Have a spot on your pants? Pour some dry solvent on it ? Right?

Wakey, wakey sunshine.

Alright General Lee, You WIN. I know that this is a touchy topic for you, so let's just leave it at the 2 of us agreeing to disagree.

As far as your sinus drip, perhas you should look at the conditions you live under.........cats, dogs, roaches, mice, rabbits, clothes detergents, hair spray, whatever.

Maybe, it's just your sinus's themselves. Tap on your cheek bones just under your eyes, if you feel pain, then you have an underlying problem other than chemicals.

                                  Nightrider

A few chemical manufacturers in the States have emailed me several times asking me to cool it with my calling their chems "poison". They prefer the word "toxic". Go Figure, what is the difference?

But these same manufacturers are the first to admit that too many of their end user customers have no respect for the ingredients or the potency of the chemicals they use.

The reason I am so hostile on this subject is that too many of us don't respect the cleaning solutions we use. There is too much of this "ah, don't worry" type attitude.

I agree that with most products we use its unlikely that a single exposure  is going to affect us very much.

However use these same chemicals all day, 6 days a week, 50 weeks a year, for 30 years ---- I don't believe there may not be repercussions.

Thats why we must identify the products that have the D2 stylized T symbol to our employees, they do after all have the right to know of the hazards to which they are exposed. Whether they be immediate or from long term exposure.

You see Mr. Nightrider, its exactly people like you and your indifference that I am trying to change ever so slightly.

Now if you'll excuse me I have another wall to go bang my head against LOL

Come bang your head here...........I need some walls torn down ...................

You know I always like to have the last word, so here goes................The same lives you are protecting are lives that belong to the typical type of person that smokes cigarettes, maybe takes drugs, stays up all night , eats unhealthy,( hot dogs, McDonalds, fries, pizza, you know all the crap ) drinks gallons of beer every week, not to mention the hard stuff, runs after and screws everything in a skirt ( flirting with sexual disease )

Then they turn around and say.........OH NO, Not Me, I'm NOT using Butyl............it's too dangerous

                          Nightrider

Steaminpile... I use Enz-All for comm...And PreKleen for res...

Emulsifier i use powerclean detergent....

Mr. Nightrider

I have been in Lee's office and have seen his van.  I have spent a lot of time with Lee this past year.  He does not lie.  He uses what he says he is using.  Lee is very pationate about his products, and gets excited.  Which I find very funny. 

So I would think you should load your brain before shotting your mouth off

You find that funny eh?

I think I'm a bit hurt.

Alright........rmcnall.................Thanks for the endorsement on Lee's behalf.

Now go collect your 5 bucks from the General

Which one are you in the Cuckoo's Nest Picture

                                Nightrider

I am not in any of those pics and I will not collect 5 bucks from Lee or anyone in those pics. 

Once again you assume too much sir     

LilNiteRidrhood wrote: You find that funny eh? I think I'm a bit hurt.

Lee: How do you let nightrider drag you into these situations?  You don't need any help in justifing what you do and how you do it?

I am talking about Rob finding my passion for the safe chems funny.

Have no fear I'll get him back.

Rob McNall, what's with your phone number on all your posts.........are you looking for a boyfriend or something.

I like the way you put ass ( in bold ) in assume ( how do you shut this crap off ) anyway do you have a fetish

so you're not in that pic, you say..........were you sick that day or what.

I thought Lee rounded up all his friends for that outting,.......... come on which one are you in that pic

                                     Nightrider

Those are my employees and main sub contractors, not even all my subs or helpers.

The only guy in the picture who doesn't make a living off of me is Ted.

As for Rob, he's one up on me, for now.

I put my phone number because Lee is my only friend and I was thinking that maybe one of you guys might someday call me and break this aufull streak of lonliness that has plauged me for so long. 

And yes I did highlight ass in my post.  I was real happy to see you picked up on this.  I was a little worried for awhile you would not see it as you so closely follow each word people say.  I was thinking you wouldn't see it as you were looking at the words and not the sence stress I put on it.

The only fetish I have is with big boobs, maybe that is why I have enjoyed this little banter you and I have had today.  I look forward to many more days of my new fetish 

Good one ( with the boobs, that is ) So now that I'm a Big Boob in your eyes..........Can I call you.

Trust me ...........you'll never be lonely with me

                               Nightrider

I will answer any call I have nothing against anyone even from Montreal.

Well..........I just had to take Rob up on the offer..........so I called him..............To my surprise he took my call.............spoke over half an hour.

How can I say bad things about him now.

I'll find a way,,,,,,,,,,,I'm sure

                                Nightrider

Doug.............. Talk to my ass.My head is busy right now

                              Nightrider

                               Nightrider

Good memory Doug, I remember those twins, standing there comparing their white shirts....................

Isn't MARKETING magical..........even after all those years...........WE REMEMBER.

                              Nightrider

Naturally, they were twins........hence the double talk about..........can you see the difference......meaning the difference between them and or the difference between the white shirts..............can't believe you missed that

                            Nightrider